Constitutional review: Treaty of Waitangi

Dr Pita Sharples, in a speech today on the Waitangi Tribunal, dropped a hint on what might be in the remit of the constitutional review:

Suffice to say that the government, as a result of the Relationship and Confidence and Supply Agreement between the Maori Party and the National Party, is planning a constitutional review, with particular reference to the place of the Treaty in the constitution.

No surprises there.

Comments

Sam Hannagan's picture

I doubt anything will come of it, and by anything I mean anything legal.  I doubt that they will ensure that...

A) That everything that needs to be done has been done to ensure any New Zealand constitution has been approved by the citizens of New Zealand, to date this has not happened.

B) That we are using the correct translation of the Treaty of Waitangi, and if the research I'm looking into right now has anything to say about it, we aren't... does the Littlewood Treaty ring any bells with anyone? Of course that would spell doom for the Waitangi Tribunal and in fact the Maori party, as their existence would then be unconstitutional as would the existence of Maori seats

LJ Holden's picture

Not sure what you mean by "anything legal". We don't even know what the terms of reference for the review are. It's apparently still being negotiated.

A) That everything that needs to be done has been done to ensure any New
Zealand constitution has been approved by the citizens of New Zealand,
to date this has not happened.

Arguably, parts of it have, specifically the electoral system (in 1992 and 1993) and CIR through their use. However you're right, there's never been a vote as such on our constitution nor is there any requirement for one except for the term of parliament and electoral system (even then that protection isn't that strong).

However I don't think that's the purpose of this constitutional review. It seems to have been an attempt at putting off the potentially difficult Maori seats problem.

B) That we are using the correct
translation of the Treaty of Waitangi, and if the research I'm looking
into right now has anything to say about it, we aren't... does the
Littlewood Treaty ring any bells with anyone? Of course that would spell
doom for the Waitangi Tribunal and in fact the Maori party, as their
existence would then be unconstitutional as would the existence of Maori
seats

I don't think the Littlewood document spells doom for the Waitangi Tribunal. Just see any of Dr Paul Moon's writing on the subject.

Chair, Republican Movement - contact me online or call on +64 27 699 1350
Sam Hannagan's picture

Arguably, parts of it have, specifically the electoral system (in 1992
and 1993) and CIR through their use. However you're right, there's never
been a vote as such on our constitution nor is there any requirement
for one except for the term of parliament and electoral system (even
then that protection isn't that strong).

It is a requirement until such time there is no constitutional requirement to do so.  The purpose of a constitution  is the people saying which of their sovereign rights they allow the government to exercise.  When New Zealand gain independence, Sovereignty was ceded to the people of New Zealand, not the Colonial government at the time.  Regardless of what any law legislated by this government says, they fact is they have no legal authority over New Zealander, until such time as a Binding referendum is held in which the people commit to a constitution. 

I don't think the Littlewood document spells doom for the Waitangi Tribunal. Just see any of Dr Paul Moon's writing on the subject.


I think you should read this book it does raise some interesting questions

LJ Holden's picture


I think you should read this book it does raise some interesting questions

Thanks, yes I've read that book, largely because someone claimed it was "suppressed." I'm afraid I think Paul Moon's analysis of it is correct - see his full article in Investigate, from I think around 2001.

Chair, Republican Movement - contact me online or call on +64 27 699 1350
Sam Hannagan's picture

I don't buy it.

What we know and what is generally accepted is that the English Version currently in use today, is not the original version of the Treaty, but a composite of previous drafts of the treaty.  The meanings between the signed version of the Maori Treaty and the English version of the treaty, are vastly different.

We know that there was a final draft of the English Version of the Treaty that went missing.

We know that the Littlewood Treaty is dated Feb 4, and that it's meaning mirrors the Maori Version of the Treaty.

We know the Littlewood Treaty was written by James Busby

We know Henry Williams who translated the treaty also wrote a Maori  dictionary still used with authority to day.

I believe Dr Paul Moon is drawing the wrong  conclusions, I have noted several points where he is assuming as fact.  He states that what is written on the 4th is irrelevant because Busby submitted a draft for approval on 3rd... he is right about that it was submitted but was rejected and was reworked through the night and on the 4th of Feb... which was submitted to be translated by Henry Williams.  So he's dead wrong, what was scribed on 4th is extremely relevant to the meaning and intent of the Treaty.

He says, "The phrase “all the people
of New Zealand” – in the setting of New
Zealand in 1840 – would simply be another
way of referring to Maori.
". I do not accept that the English would write themselves in a 2nd class citizens in a new colony, I also reject the idea that Busby or Hobson would need to frivolously repeat to whom the article applies.

I think he is more interested in the status quo and has no perspective of the Littlewood side of the argument. 

LJ Holden's picture

I don't think there's anything I can say here. Either way, this discussion is kind of irrelevant to your first point and the constitutional review.

Chair, Republican Movement - contact me online or call on +64 27 699 1350

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