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Dip in republic support expected: Republican Movement
MEDIA RELEASE: 12 March 2010
"The polling by Research New Zealand showing a dip in support for New Zealand becoming a republic to 32% is expected after a Prince William's royal tour" said Lewis Holden, chair of the Republican Movement.
Following Prince William's visit in 2005, a survey by The Press found 27% of New Zealanders supported a republic. Support for a republic eventually recovered, peaking at 47% in a survey by The Sunday Star-Times in 2006. Support for the monarchy is also in long-term decline. In 1992, TVNZ found three-quarters of New Zealanders supported the monarchy.
"That figure has now decreased to just on 50%, with some surveys showing it to be even less. Significantly, once Prince Charles is added in support drops even further. The reality is Charles will become King before William under all usual circumstances" concluded Mr Holden.
NOTES
The Research New Zealand survey can be found at: http://www.researchnz.com/pdf/Media%20Releases/RNZ%20Media%20Release%20-%202010-03-04%20NZ%20Republic.pdf
"The polling by Research New Zealand showing a dip in support for New Zealand becoming a republic to 32% is expected after a Prince William's royal tour" said Lewis Holden, chair of the Republican Movement.
Following Prince William's visit in 2005, a survey by The Press found 27% of New Zealanders supported a republic. Support for a republic eventually recovered, peaking at 47% in a survey by The Sunday Star-Times in 2006. Support for the monarchy is also in long-term decline. In 1992, TVNZ found three-quarters of New Zealanders supported the monarchy.
"That figure has now decreased to just on 50%, with some surveys showing it to be even less. Significantly, once Prince Charles is added in support drops even further. The reality is Charles will become King before William under all usual circumstances" concluded Mr Holden.
NOTES
The Research New Zealand survey can be found at: http://www.researchnz.com/pdf/Media%20Releases/RNZ%20Media%20Release%20-%202010-03-04%20NZ%20Republic.pdf
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There is an article about the
The article quotes Locke: "The question is not whether the monarchy has a lot of power over us. In practice it doesn’t. The problem is that bowing before the British Queen reflects a colonial mentality."
Maybe the article omitted it, but I suppose he chose not to say or acknowledge that she is Queen of New Zealand. The Queen has said that she does not expect old protocol to be followed and that it is an individual's choice whether they bow or curtsy. Presumably then Locke does not like it if an individual NZer goes against what Locke thinks is approriate and decides to bow when meeting the Queen. How dare others have a different opinion from Locke and decide to show respect to our Queen.
The quote comes from Locke's
Republican Movement chair
The article mentioned that.
The article mentioned that.
So after he had sworn/affirmed allegiance to the monarch, he had given that speech. Just think of the impact if before the house he had refused allegiance to the monarch and had been prevented from taking his seat. It may have galvanised his Green colleagues into formulating an offivcial Green Party republican policy. So now, instead of a rough private member's bill on a republic process, there may now be a more acceptably drafted bill before the house.
I have previously suggested
Support for The Republic of
The Research NZ polling question included the misleading statement "New Zealand is a constitutional monarchy and our current Head of State is the Queen of England." This is plain wrong as the NZ Sovereign is the Queen Of NZ, not the Monarch of the UK, Australia, Canada or even the former Kingdom of England. This misleading question could put into the mind of those who are not fully informed about the workings of our constitution that the NZ goverment may currently still be beholden to the government of England (i.e the United Kingdom) too. Most monarchists let alone republicans would agree to that state of affairs! If the wording of the question had been correct, I would not be surprised if the support for "a republic" would have been even less than the 32% recorded. As it is, the ridiculous question renders the poll suspect at best.
However, the 32% republican support is a significant drop from the 2008 figure of 42%. The questions were different as the 2008 question stated: "Australians are considering becoming a republic, which means the Queen of England will no longer be their Head of State." but it still included the surprisingly incorrect "Queen of England". In 2008 somehow linking republicanism to the Australians, may have produced a backlash in this NZ poll against republicanism :)
The HRH Prince William effect in the 2010 poll may have deflated republican support as may the reference to Australian republicanism in the 2008 poll. Provided they had equal strength on the respective polls, that would still leave a drop from 2008 to 2010 in support of a republic of 10%.
Despite that, it was interesting that support for republicanism was strongest in the Upper North Island at 40%. The Upper North Island has the largest proportion of overseas born people. Support for republicanism was weakest in the South Island (26%) where the proportion of natural-born NZers is greater.
Anyway.....this poll should be filed in the dust bin. At least a properly drafted and executed (and expensive) referendum would be more reliable.
"The Research NZ polling
So you really think some people who now supported republic would have supported monarchy in case the correct title (Queen of New Zealand) was mentioned instead? I doubt it, as it is the British connection and the last remnants of the imperial mentality that keeps the monarchist support high. Everyone familiar with NZ law understands of course that the title "Queen of England" is incorrect. I very much doubt this mistake could really affect anyone's answer. People still know pretty well that it is Elizabeth II that is referred to.
If a misworded poll is enough to give New Zealanders (or Australians or Canadians) the impression that they are still subject to British rule, then there is nothing to be done. Except the declaration of a republic, to make things clear.
I would say the wording of
I would say the wording of poll questions would most definitely affect the responses. Any referendum would have to use correct titles.
An argument that figures large in the repertoire of republican arguments is that as recent immigration has reduced the proportion of NZers who have British ancestry, then the British-based monarchy is becoming obsolete and irrelevant. Presumably then the "British connection and the last remnants of the imperial mentality that keeps the monarchist support high" is not the drawcard that it was and the "Queen of England" would not necessarily garner more votes in any poll than "the Queen of NZ".
I doubt most people
Republican Movement chair
Most/some might not be aware
Mentioning "Queen of England"
No matter how many people are arriving from other parts of the world to NZ, a clear majority of New Zealanders nevertheless have British ancestors. And a majority of those moving to New Zealand from abroad (that is, from countries that are not Commonwealth Realms) certainly hold democratic British traditions in high regard, as the NZ they want to be their home wouldn't be what it is without Westminster system, common law or the English language.
If the project to create a NZ republic is tied to some sort of denial of British or Maori heritage (or both), the republican cause is doomed, no matter what.
If the project to create a NZ
That I regret is what is happening. Why is republican support so strong among the left. The education system and msm is stripping anglo/celtic new zealand of it's roots. People with british ancestry dont care, They wont vote based on there bloodlines. But new kiwis do. Our immigration policy
and cultural marxism is proving this. The GG said in a speech that asian and south american migration to nz in the last 15 years has given us a unique sense of nationhood and that we are more confident of who we are as a nation, which is complete garbage. Who do these new kiwis vote for.
I have never seen this country so divided, When I watch nz sporting teams play halfe the crowd are waving the flags of the visiting nation, and these people get to vote on the issue. When will anglo/celtic kiwis start identifying themselves as a race and people and community like the indian/chinese/samoan/croation/brazilians do.
In the past it was just us and our maori brothers so we did not need to be ethno centric we were just kiwis. Republic day needs to stay as waitangi day, Otherwise like Australia day it will turn into a lavish multicultural bash featuring all the national costumes and flags of the other nations yet nothing for us. But all the commies will say that this is what nz day is all about. Having anglo content will be deemed illegal and unproper as the republic day is the day that we all cut our ties and culture to britain and we can celebrate the real cultures that make up kiwis like indian/chinese. Go to the war memorial museum and look at the names who died on the wall, That should tell you our culture. Of course republicans argue the monarchy is not part of our culture, so lets go rural and tell all the baby boomrs and war veterans that this is not there culture and we the young liberal,trendy,multicults will put them in line and tell them. The government is not the giver of rights.
If the project to create a NZ
Well that's good, because it's not. The case of the Republican Movement for a republic is to affirm our independence, define our nationhood and improve our democracy and checks and balances. Not one part of that is about denying our heritage - our heritage is necessarily British, but that doesn't mean we are compelled to keep the monarchy.
Why is republican support so strong among the left.
Well "so strong" is an overstatement - it certainly is stronger on the left, but that doesn't mean there isn't strong right-wing support for a republic. The last stats I saw put support amongst the National Party at around 40%; our first openly republican PM was Jim Bolger for National.
The education system and msm is stripping anglo/celtic new zealand of it's roots. People with british ancestry dont care, They wont vote based on there bloodlines.
For my own part, I'm proud of my British heritage, unlike most of the Anglophiles I acknowledge the significant republican element to that heritage - that ensured whereas France, Russia and Germany lost their monarchies, Britain and Scandinavia kept theirs due to a long standing process of republicanism. I see republicanism in New Zealand as part of that process - after all, we're basically a republic now, we're just an incomplete republic.
Republican Movement chair
"Well that's good, because
I agree wholeheartedly. An independent nation should be proud enough to keep all the traditions that really matter, but a HoS resident in Europe is not one of them. Westminster system, common law etc. are.
However, I believe it is partly the monarch's Britishness that makes the change quite impossible during the present reign. The monarch's successors are British too, of course, but they are Britons without any relevance to the New Zealand, unlike the Queen, who to many all across the Commonwealth still is the personification of the WWII generations.
I actually agree with the
Forcing? Who's forcing
Republican Movement chair
"Why is republican support so
In the desire to accommodate immigrants from different cultures, I do think that some people from the predominant anglo/celtic and Maori cutures are starting to feel excluded and undervalued. I think this feeling of being undervalued on the part of anglo NZ is not helped by some people urging for a change in flag and removal of the monarchy as a way to help accommodate these new immigrants from other cultures.
some people urging for a
That's certainly not the main reason for either change though WM. It's almost universally a question of constitutional and political relevance, on both counts republicans feel the monarchy fails. Obviously the flag has more to do with cultural grounds, but that's still only part of the story.
Republican Movement chair
In the desire to accommodate
Thats how I feel in a nutshell. I am concerned the republic of new zealand will be a way of further demonising anglo/celtic new zealand. The thing is people are not looking at it like lewis does, He is an academic who has a black and white outlook and can just say to people grow up, nonsense and cultural insecurity. Most people are concerned and think in a shade of grey. Are there any tradesman and non graduates that sit on the republican board. Jordan carter,david farrar and lewis all politcal and high profile bloggers. The fact that we have ethnic and race based and gender ministries and educational quotos supported by most republicans yet say the monarchy is a race and reliougous based and not based upon merit as lewis said on tv are issues that kiwis hold dear. so kiwis support race and gender and educational based ministries and ethnic reps on the supercity are these values that kwis hold dear.
The thing is people are not
I'm not an academic. Not even close - like most New Zealanders I work normal business hours for reasonable wages. I don't think I'm black and white on the republic issue - I got involved in the RM because I was concerned we would never have the debate to begin with, let alone get to some sort of conclusion.
Are there any tradesman and non graduates that sit on the republican board.
We don't have quotas based on race, profession of academic qualification :-) but yes, you're right our exec is mainly university politicos, but not necessarily "elites" as some allege. Perhaps you could put your name forward?
Jordan carter,david farrar and lewis all politcal and high profile bloggers.
Well maybe Jordan and David, but certainly not me! Savage, Jeremy, Mike and Dean are all outside of that.
the monarchy is a race and reliougous based and not based upon merit as lewis said on tv are issues that kiwis hold dear. so kiwis support race and gender and educational based ministries and ethnic reps on the supercity are these values that kwis hold dear.
No - let me be clear, the reason why there is angst over Maori seats on the Super City is exactly because New Zealanders hold egalitarian values; the argument from Maori is that you won't get equal representation of ethnic groups without specific seats for Maori; personally my view is that is nonsense, however that is the argument they use.
Republican Movement chair
We don't have quotas based on
Sorry I did not ask or inquire if you had quotas, I dont believe in quotas but wonder why most of your board are high profile and moderatley influencial like jordan and david, after all you said you dont want it to be about personalities. How can I put my name down for board or chair and who votes on these issues. Obviously I woud have to sign up.
Cheers
Dan
As a republican based on
Republicans say it is because
I wouldn't say that's an attitude of foreign born republicans, it's an attitude of republicans in general - including those of us of Anglo-Saxon lineage.
They vote repulic cause most are asian or non anglo that have no connection to the monarchy or our flag, So just come out and say it.
The Pacific Island community is more strongly pro-monarchy than other groups - does that mean they have some connection to the monarchy? Not at all - they support the monarchy for their own reasons.
Republican Movement chair
Pacifica people make up 6% of
When we become a republic arguments on immigration will be put aside as
advocates will claim we have no connection to britain anymore lets asianise our country. You are to young to remember but there are kiwis aged 35-40 that have seen the old and new nz you have only seen the new you fabian liberal.
Actually, I grew up during
When we become a republic arguments on immigration will be put aside as
advocates will claim we have no connection to britain anymore lets asianise our country.
I strongly doubt that. I've never heard anyone say "We can't have more immigration because we're linked to Britain". The arguments are around the capacity of immigrants to integrate, infrastructure (i.e. additional pressure) and multiculturalism.
Republican Movement chair
I wouldn't say that's an
I wouldn't say that's an attitude of foreign born republicans, it's an attitude of republicans in general - including those of us of Anglo-Saxon lineage.
Then why If they are prouder kiwis than me do they support there country of birth and bloode over new zealand. This does exist lewis on a major scale. Anglo-celtic people are the only people in society that are not ethno centric or pro there blood and culture.
So is an indian migrant who is a republican, Is he a prouder kiwi than a 6th generation monarchist, Does he love nz so much that he want to change the flag and believes we are confident and healthy and strong bla bla bla.
Love the way you cut n paste to challenge only arguments you can attack.Holden immigrants are anti nz culture and past, They dont give a toss about our history or anzac day hence ms vitali at the muesum another leftwing appointee. look at australia day on sky tv.It is always about some foreigner getting there passports from krudd and saying how aussies are racist and need to change the flag, then he goes down george street waving an indian flag in national dress saying this is what australia day is about. Do you have any tradesman on your commitee or non academic graduate politicos.
Then why If they are prouder
Ah, well that's simply not true - being a republic is simply about being pro-New Zealand.
This does exist lewis on a major scale. Anglo-celtic people are the only people in society that are not ethno centric or pro there blood and culture.
That's a massive assumption. Of course there's ethno-centric Anglo-Celts, just as there is ethno-centric Indians or Chinese or Tongans... not sure what you're point is.
So is an indian migrant who is a republican, Is he a prouder kiwi than a 6th generation monarchist, Does he love nz so much that he want to change the flag and believes we are confident and healthy and strong bla bla bla.
I didn't say that at all - I simply said the attitude amongst republicans is almost universally pro-New Zealand in outlook. Just being a republican doesn't make you a prouder Kiwi, nor does having a long lineage in this country.
Love the way you cut n paste to challenge only arguments you can attack.
No, I only respond to points worth responding to.
Holden immigrants are anti nz culture and past,
Another major assumption. Where are the immigrants protesting against Anzac Day or Waitangi Day? There aren't any.
They dont give a toss about our history or anzac day hence ms vitali at the muesum another leftwing appointee.
Err, no. Vitali's problem is that she wanted to make the museum an events centre to get more people through the doors. Also she was appointed by a fairly conservative board of historians.
Do you have any tradesman on your commitee or non academic graduate politicos.
I just said above we don't (although Savage runs his own commercial painting business). That's not our fault and we certainly don't exclude anyone for joining based on their ethnicity or job, and as I said if you think that it's important to have someone from that background then why not put your name forward?
Republican Movement chair
"Ah, well that's simply not
"Ah, well that's simply not true - being a republic is simply about being pro-New Zealand." (from Lewis)
Being a monarchist is being pro-NZ. Period.
Being a republican is being in favour of changing NZ (by removing its current Sovereign and the monarchy it has had since the nation's birth in 1840).
"Anglo-celtic people are the only people in society that are not ethno centric or pro there blood and culture." (from Dan)
I think the anglo-celt influence on NZ has been quite dominating so that British and Irish migrants have quickly become NZised. Second and third generation Greek NZers may still look to Greece to refresh the Greek part of their identity but Anglo-Celt NZers feel the need to look no further than NZ itself as the identity is NZer. Second or third generation anglo NZers do not regard themselves as being British NZers. I think some of the resentment or conflict occurs when some of these anglo-NZers feel other cultures are being "allowed" to have an influence on the "NZer" identity - an identity that some anglo-NZers feel had been in their exclusive domain or shared only with Maori.
That's not our fault and we
True Its like people in the media that say national and aanct has to many white people, But truth be told anyone can join those parties not just white
people, Its just alot of non white people in nz dont believe in property rights and low taxes and freedom of choice or personal choice but there is nothing to stop anyone joining so fair point.
Dan
Lewis I might put my name
Excellent.
Republican Movement chair
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